This is a read only archive of pad.okfn.org. See the shutdown announcement for details.

XmuYn2sFDw Open call with the Personal Data & Privacy WG/Community 



Interactive session No.1

Participation details-
Date: May 13, 2004
Time: 16.00 BST
Duration: 1 hour
Meeting tool: Mumble
Note: Unless there are any objections, we intend to record this call. 
    

Participants-

Discussion points- 

0. overview of joint ORG/OKFN project  https://docs.google.com/a/okfn.org/document/d/1oDUV85GTa8inUX0jP9xtzbOToTT7Q8D1NbdHS4I7KlE/edit
Sally will give a verbal overview for those who will not access the document above

Overview of ORG outputs https://docs.google.com/document/d/1CJwNXAN-w337FpdjAR9i4e9PMEApgTwdkrG8BGcjl-s/edit?usp=sharing

1. Purpose of the expert workshop vis the overall objective of the project
Looking at the workshop, I'd expect that conversation will make day 2 redundant in addition to already being highly inappropriate. Renegotiating what the list is, based on a small subset of people who happen to be in the room, unpaid, in London, in the middle of the work day, is unlikely to be an approach that will be welcomed by an international list of volunteers.
Looking at day 1, what have you asked Caspar to do?

2. Working relation between the project and the WG/Role of the WG
3. Address specific individual differences about the neccessity of the expert meeting or any other aspect of the project


Questions here:
1. Some issues in the privacy space are proving tangential to the rather specific aim of this WG, what sorts of engagement should we have with these issues- for example on how corporations handle personal data in big data (fairdata) or PbD systems, encryption/surveillance? 
The question is how do people control data and how, because corporations are doing it for them.  What is the specific aim of the working group? The aim is different  and broader than teh project, and also includes privacy advocates.

The important question is to ask what do people want to do in the WG beyond the expert group, and that hasnt happened yet.

Find out what is a priority for people considering that it is a new area. Having a more open and extensive discussion around it,

The Open Notice is holding a fringe event on Data Control and data privacy, is of ineterst to the WG, a series of activities through summer, and th einvolvement of the working group is welcome. 

set up a monthy call to discuss  what the WG could enage with.
2. Should the WG be reactive and opportunistic, responding to the these issues, given that it has a limited time to deal with work scoped out in the workplan and which must be reported on?
3. Should participation in June workshop open to anyone, or only those who want to participate, not listen and consume the event (while writing their PHd thesis and simultaneously tweeting)?
the expert meeting has participants who are not really interested in the WG and so the idea is to tap into their expertise, and not engage in an ongoing process.
- 3. I would prefer open, it is a good opportunity to share our views but also have our views challenged.
The meeting should also create some space for others to discuss their activities
4. Can we achieve some consensus on comms and work platforms? OKFN uses GDrive and Skype extensively, if this WG doesn't want to follow path we need some standard alternatives. Right now every new call or shared document is a decision/problem to solve.
- 4. Is it possible to setup a Redmine installation for project management? It is adaptable and beautiful with the right skins, can be self-hosted and used for other OKFN projects, OKFNSE is looking into it. - http://www.redmine.org/

Option to use Wiki, and mumble for calls.  A concensus would be hard to achieve but try to open source tools as often as possible.
- Very much agree on this.

A doodle to be sent out. Objectives of the monthly call.
- https://dudle.inf.tu-dresden.de/ - Is the Privacy-version of Doodle. I suggest to use https://prism-break.org. Noted for next time!

A space for the Open Notice Dazza to discuss the summer activities. 

I'd suggest that there are existing consensus answers on 2, which make 1 and 4 inappropriate questions.  However, you weren't to know that before now. If you wish to come in as OKFN staff and change 2, that is a conversation you should have with me in the first instance, and go about in a radically different manner.

Mumble:
For first time user: Download the mumble client: http://www.mumble.com/ (mac, windows or linux)
- Are local groups elibigle to use this international setup? It is not hosted by OKFN right? Will look into it!

Agenda: 


    

Draft agenda expert workshop 10/11 June in London

1. Bring together interest groups and stakeholder experts to identify and agree on the  the issues that need to be addressed in this environment and how to do so (specific activities and resources). 
2. Agree on the statutes that should guide future activities (guiding principles for opening up data, and an agreement on the definition of the terms). 

Day 1: Mapping the environment: Issues and Interventions on Open Data & Privacy- 9.30-17.30

9.30-10.00        Welcome

10.00-10.30        Overview of the personal data and privacy environment-UK and international context- Casper Bowden

10.30-11.00        Personal data and and the privacy framework- John Clippinger

11.00-11.30        Issues Map: Anonymization, Data sharing, monetization of personal data- Javier Ruiz 

11.30-11.45        Coffee break

11.45-13.00        Existing legal, regulatory, policy frameworks on open data and privacy- Sally Deffor

13.00-13.45        Lunch break

13.45-15.00        Existing interventions solutions- tools, principles, regulations, actors

15.00-15.15        Coffee break

15.15-16.30
        
16.30-17.30        Opportunities 
17.30                Close


Day 2: Agreeing on the fundamentals, terminologies, principles, role of the WG: 9.30-15.00

9.30-10.00        Welcome

10.00-11.15        Principles and definitions governing our work- Sally Deffor

11.15-11.30        Coffee break

11.30-13.00        Role of the Working Group- Javier Ruiz

13.00-14.00        Lunch

14.00-15.00        Mapping the way forward- Javier Ruiz

15.00                Close
    
    
Meeting notes

Present at the meeting: Sally, Katelyn, Javier, Mark Lizar, Reuben,Sander, Javier
Apologies: Christopher and Dazza (could not connect)

Sally, and then later Katelyn explains the objective of the call: to enagege with the WG on the project, expert workshop, and also address specific concerns.
Javier speaks about how the project was founded, due to the need for open data community  to conisder privacy. ORG focused on right to the internet, access to information, promoting open data. Slightly different perspectives to the Open Knowledge but same goal of exploring the space. Started discussion with OSF in summer and teamed up with Open Knowledge to achieve the following:

1. Put clarity into this area- Where to draw the line in opening up personal data, what ar the rights of individuals who want to open up their data? 

2. Bring together interest people, for example through the  WG, aggregate expertise, make policy input, undertake capacity building and produce policy documents. Relevant content to be developed and shared with people form other regions, for example  in Latin America in the personal data environment.

Sally mentions that the Workshop is a key output, and it will support in developing  content for this area, there is a need to be able to agree on how we define our work and talk about it so the right terms has to be agrred upon and documented in a living document. 
Also need for a guide if   individuals wantt to open up their own personal data, what are the implications on them, others and the open data environment, what regulates this activity, as well as data publishers who want to do so, what should they consider.
Question: Is the WG a product of the proposal?
Sandar answers- No, not exactly, the WG was formed prior to the project being developed, and others for example Sam Smith came onbaord to play a more hands on role in its coordination. Then the funding was attained, to undertake the project and now goal is to allign the activities of the two and see how they can support each other. 

What are the Funded outputs: 
    Open Knowledge 
  1. Expert workshop 
  2. (concerte plans for next phases of project @Sally 
  3. Support working group, invite people to join, expand, keep mailing list going, update webpage 
  4. Principles document (living output to be continually updated) 
  5. Make input to policy where appropriate 
  6. Support other activities in the area, for example RDF, Open Notice, PI
Open Rights group: 
  1.     Commission a series of papers - combine 
  2. POlicy interventions (OGP for Example) 
  3. Writing a chapter for OPen Government Guide
  4. ORG is contributing to policy and research documents rather than community-building. 
  5.  
Questions addressed:
1. Some issues in the privacy space are proving tangential to the rather specific aim of this WG, what sorts of engagement should we have with these issues- for example on how corporations handle personal data in big data (fairdata) or PbD systems, encryption/surveillance? 
2. Should the WG be reactive and opportunistic, responding to the these issues, given that it has a limited time to deal with work scoped out in the workplan and which must be reported on?
The question is how do people control data because corporations are doing it for them, so these issues are closely related and can be addressed by the WG.

3. So therefore  what is the specific aim of the working group? 
The aim is different  and broader than the project, and also includes privacy advocates, but not entirely.

The important question is to ask what do people want to do in the WG beyond the expert group, and that hasnt happened yet.

Find out what is a priority for people in the group considering that it is a new area. Having a more open and extensive discussion around it.

For example, The Open Notice is holding a fringe event on Data Control and data privacy, which is of interest and parallel to the WG , undertaking a series of activities through summer, and the involvement of the working group is welcome and encouraged. 

3. Should participation in June workshop open to anyone, or only those who want to participate, not listen and consume the event (while writing their PHd thesis and simultaneously tweeting)?
The expert meeting has participants who are not really interested in the WG and so the idea is to tap into their expertise, and not engage in an ongoing process with them. However, the meeting should also create some space for others to discuss their activities
4. Can we achieve some consensus on comms and work platforms? OKFN uses GDrive and Skype extensively, if this WG doesn't want to follow path we need some standard alternatives. Right now every new call or shared document is a decision/problem to solve.
Option to use Wiki, and mumble for calls.  A concensus would be hard to achieve but try to open source tools as often as possible.


Actions!
A monthly call to be set-up to discuss issues of interest. Sally to send out a doodle link  to collate convenient times-clearly outline the objectives of the monthly call.
Provide space for the Open Notice/Dazza to discuss the summer activities at the June meeting.